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  #3081  
Old 11-06-2014, 06:47 PM
brushpile brushpile is offline
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This is Washington Hawthorn from the MDC. It doesn't have fruit for lack of rain. It has the same application as Cockspur.



The thorns. Hawthorns will keep trespassers out and hawthorns are great wildlife plants for a wide variety of wildlife from birds to deer. I go in about once a year to take pictures, and I go in very carefully! Eventually it will canopy, and only wildlife will enter.

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  #3082  
Old 11-06-2014, 07:07 PM
wbpdeer wbpdeer is offline
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Default You Should Have a Field Day

Brush,

I wish you would have a field day. I would certainly make a donation and attend. Late March or Early April after snow is less of a risk.

What you have posted in the last day or so is exactly what guys like me need. For instances: not pin oak but Shumard Oak. The low down on the 4 dogwoods.

Had any backstraps yet out that nice buck.

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  #3083  
Old 11-06-2014, 10:13 PM
dogghr dogghr is offline
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That was just an awesome and interesting post , Brush. What a great place you've made. I've got those Hawthornes also. Make me nervous around tractor and ATV with the thorns but never had a problem yet.
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  #3084  
Old 11-07-2014, 02:43 AM
brushpile brushpile is offline
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In the Spring of 2013 doctorbrady cut the tops off my flowering crabapples, so that only the trunk remained, and grafted on scions. This is one of those trees.



The graft.

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  #3085  
Old 11-07-2014, 02:59 AM
brushpile brushpile is offline
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This is cover I planted that has become so thick that the dog doesn't go in there. On the edge of that cover are apple trees planted for cover and browse.



These are Dolgo Crabapples I bought by the bundle for less than a dollar each. Dolgos produce a sweet crabapple and make good browse. Since these aren't grafted trees it'll be years before they produce apples, but apples are fast growing and produce a tree where I need a tree. It's my hope to tie this apple thicket to my Hawthorn thicket.

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  #3086  
Old 11-07-2014, 03:11 AM
brushpile brushpile is offline
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The Dolgos do get browsed, but I can't slide the tube up or rabbits will girdle the exposed trunk this Winter. In fact I need to protect trunks before it snows or rabbits will top kill trees like apple, chestnut, chinkapin oak, peach, plum, apricot... basically anything that produces sweet fruit or nuts.

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  #3087  
Old 11-07-2014, 09:34 PM
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Your place is awesome.You have obviously put in a many hours of hard labor.
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  #3088  
Old 11-07-2014, 09:47 PM
brushpile brushpile is offline
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Originally Posted by flyfixer View Post
Your place is awesome.You have obviously put in a many hours of hard labor.

Thanks, I just need one normal year of average rainfall. I see deer here almost daily, but when all the leaves Fall the deer will move off into thick cedars to Winter. I'm working to convert Hybrid Poplar to cedar and pine.

HP was made to be hinge cut every 2-3 years and when evergreens are added to that I'll have the thickest woods in the area, while also having pockets of fruit and nut trees.
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  #3089  
Old 11-07-2014, 11:07 PM
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I've noted red cedar growing quite happily in more than partial shade. I plan to use it to thicken up my woods in spots.
I've seen some cedars dead from complete shading after a few years.

Sure is a labor of love you have there.
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  #3090  
Old 11-07-2014, 11:30 PM
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I've noted red cedar growing quite happily in more than partial shade. I plan to use it to thicken up my woods in spots.
I've seen some cedars dead from complete shading after a few years.

Sure is a labor of love you have there.

You took the words right out of my next post which is about thickening rows of trees.

These are rows of trees, and rows are unnatural and make poor cover. However, this was an open field, so they're a start. The next step is planting cedars to break up the rows and hinge cutting as needed to allow Sun in for the Cedars.

I've just ordered a roll of Lumite from John, and I'll dig cedars and Fall plant after deer season. I'll also plant Redbud and Eastern Wahoo, which grow in the understory, but nothing beats a cedar for cover in MO. In Northern climates spruce is even better than cedar.



Once I add trees planted in Lumite between these rows I'll return the area to nature and let the weeds grow. Eventually there should be buckbrush as the stand ages.

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  #3091  
Old 11-07-2014, 11:47 PM
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These HP are expendable. I grew them in two years of drought, and they can be replaced in as little time. Every other one will be cut and treated with glyphosate, and the void will be planted with pine and Cedar.



Even if I wasn't planting pine and cedar, every other one of these HP need to be thinned.

Notice the path Matty is standing on. On the far side of that path are apples, and these HP are planted to shade those apples from hot afternoon Sun that was baking them in the heat of Summer.
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  #3092  
Old 11-08-2014, 02:02 AM
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This is Deciduous Holly/Winterberry/Possumhaw. Deer browse the leaves and birds eat the berries in Winter. It's dioecious with only the female producing berries.

While not preferred browse, deer do browse the twigs, over 40 birds are known to eat the berries, the limbs zig zag to produce cover when the leaves are off the tree, and on moist ground they form DENSE THICKETS.



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  #3093  
Old 11-08-2014, 11:30 PM
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This is a Chestnut growing in the edge of NWSG. On the Brushpile, NWSG is worthless, and will be flat to the ground all Winter. However, NWSG with trees planted in it are good cover. I've converted all of my NWSG to NWSG/Pines or NWSG/Chestnut which will be savannas in a matter of a few years, vs oak, which takes almost a lifetime.

I was talked into planting NWSG by the MDC who is interested in Quail, but no Quail have come.
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  #3094  
Old 11-08-2014, 11:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brushpile View Post
This is a Chestnut growing in the edge of NWSG. On the Brushpile, NWSG is worthless, and will be flat to the ground all Winter. However, NWSG with trees planted in it are good cover. I've converted all of my NWSG to NWSG/Pines or NWSG/Chestnut which will be savannas in a matter of a few years, vs oak, which takes almost a lifetime.

I was talked into planting NWSG by the MDC who is interested in Quail, but no Quail have come.

That tree looks quite healthy. Good size on the trunk. All trees dormant in your area now?
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  #3095  
Old 11-09-2014, 12:26 AM
buckdeer1 buckdeer1 is offline
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I have some Blackwell switch that won't flatten very easily.That being said I have always said deer are like fish and if you put structure in NWSG that where they will bed.Looks great.it's funny how you aren't that far from Kansas but have so many different shrubs and trees
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  #3096  
Old 11-09-2014, 02:57 AM
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After losing a 14 point buck, I asked doctorbrady if he was going to breed his Bavarian Mountain Hound, and he said he wasn't breeding her, but recommend a kennel that sold German Wirehaired Dachshunds. Really, Dachshunds??? Doctorbrady always gives good advice, so I contacted a kennel in WI, that sold dogs from Germany where the hunting strain remains pure, and I learned about Teckels, the German name for Wirehaired Dachshunds.

Normally there's a long wait and a deposit well in advance to get a Teckel, but I got lucky.

http://trackingteckels.com/

So on Thanksgiving Day my wife and I will drive to WI and pick up our pup and begin training our blood tracking dog while she's 8 weeks old.. We have second pick from the Drosselbart/"Issit" Rumpelstilzchen litter, pictured on this page, and if you scroll down you'll see recovered deer.

http://www.hessenjaeger.com/WireDachshund.html

Next deer season I look forward to both blood tracking and deer hunting. Blood tracking is a misnomer, blood tracking dogs are used to find deer when there's no blood trail, a faint blood trail, or the trail ends without recovering the deer. Using a blood tracking dog or having access to one is part of ethical hunting.
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  #3097  
Old 11-09-2014, 03:07 AM
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Originally Posted by buckdeer1 View Post
I have some Blackwell switch that won't flatten very easily.That being said I have always said deer are like fish and if you put structure in NWSG that where they will bed.Looks great.it's funny how you aren't that far from Kansas but have so many different shrubs and trees

Yes, structure in NWSG is important, and I know that Switch makes a better Winter stand than Big Blue and Indian, but I'm hoping that by adding structure my NWSG will have the shelter to keep it standing.

The goal is to have Pine and Chestnut Savanna in 3-4 years. I know I can have a pine savanna in 3-4 years and pines in tall grass are hard to beat for cover.
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  #3098  
Old 11-09-2014, 03:13 AM
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Originally Posted by lakngulf View Post
That tree looks quite healthy. Good size on the trunk. All trees dormant in your area now?

Most trees are dormant and to be safe I'll wait until about Thanksgiving to dig and plant cedar.

The chestnuts are butting on girth but not the height I'd like to see. This tree is in Lumite and was only watered twice all Summer. I believe the tree was planted in 2011.
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  #3099  
Old 11-09-2014, 08:41 AM
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I was talked into planting NWSG by the MDC who is interested in Quail, but no Quail have come.

Weeds are FAR better for quail than NWSG is. 80/20 is a good mix for quail, 80% being weeds and 20 in NWSG's.
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  #3100  
Old 11-10-2014, 03:50 PM
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Weeds are FAR better for quail than NWSG is. 80/20 is a good mix for quail, 80% being weeds and 20 in NWSG's.

I agree. A pure stand of NWSG is dead space. It's not good cover in Winter, and it's not a good food source, but mixed with trees and shrubs it fills in to create cover and thermal protection. If I had it to do over I would have planted switch grass.

A remember D Gallow's visit. His focus was on weeds, because weeds are what deer eat. Killing fescue is the first step in QDM. When fescue is killed the seed bank is amazing!
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