Go Back   QDMA Forums > General QDM > Bowhunters' Firepot

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #21  
Old 03-16-2012, 02:29 PM
Tap's Avatar
Tap Tap is offline
QDMA Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Westmoreland Co Pa (zone 6a)
Posts: 3,277
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by doctorbrady View Post
Forget the open on impacts. I know that makes some people upset, but with low weight bows you will have lots of sorrows with ANY mechanical out there. Simple physics wins out. Cut on impact heads will improve penetration as long as they are sturdy and don' curl at the tip. My preference is a single bevel head with the same bevel as the fletch. I shoot Abowyers, but there are a number of great heads including Eclipse, Grizzlies, and many more. My wife killed everything she shot at in Africa a few years back with a 40# bow and razor sharp Eclipse heads, including a kudu, oryx and springbok. Good, short blood trails.

I started shooting single bevel Eclipse from my 52 lb recurve a couple of years ago (killed 3 mature bucks including a 275 pounder) and I love them. The 275 pound buck went 30 yards.
Read some of the reports of Ed Ashby's broadhead testing. This guy knows as much about broadheads as anyone. His tests have been very extensive. If he likes single bevel heads so much I decided to try them. I don't think I'll ever switch back to a double bevel head.
http://www.alaskabowhunting.com/Dr.-Ed-Ashby-W26.aspx

I have shot several deer with Magnus heads and was not particularly impressed with the blood trail either. They are as solid a head as any made, but I don't understand why some of the blood trails were marginal.
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 03-16-2012, 07:05 PM
bbarrett's Avatar
bbarrett bbarrett is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Live in Louisiana, farms in Missouri and illinois
Posts: 555
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tap View Post
I started shooting single bevel Eclipsel.

i have never seen these before.. I looked at them.. seems like a single bevel head is wasting a large portion of the cutting surface??? only one side is sharp?
what am i missing?
need to find a new broadhead for my wife.. she has had several good kills with rage.. but this year stuck a nice buck and didnt get any real penatration...
she was shooting the rage.. prior to this shot,, most of her bucks died in sight.
Bryan
Attached Images
 

Last edited by bbarrett : 03-16-2012 at 07:11 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 03-18-2012, 10:26 AM
Mojostick Mojostick is offline
QDMA Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Michigan
Posts: 445
Default

There is no such as a "female weight" for broadheads. The proper broadhead weight that one needs is determined by arrow spine.

For example, if a woman or youth is shooting a shorter, stiffer spined arrow, they'll need to add MORE weight to the tip to weaken the arrow, not less.

I shoot traditional bows now, where proper arrow spine/tip weight matching is critical to perfect flight coming off a shelf of the riser. Traditional archers can achieve perfect arrow flight by doing what is called "bare shafting". Essentially with bare shafting, you shoot just a bare shaft (no fletching) and you tinker with head weight and/or arrow length until you can get a bare shaft to fly perfectly straight, like a dart.
While paper tuning is better for compounds because actually seeing any flight imperfection of a bare shaft coming off a fast compound is nearly impossible, it shows the same results. Either your arrow is perfect, too weak, too stiff, nock high or nock low.

In my opinion, too many compound shooters don't take everything into consideration, don't properly paper tune their arrows and ultimately aren't getting as good of flight as they should. With modern rests, releases, etc, compound shooters can get away with a lot more "slop" and I think many compound shooters think they can rely solely on spine charts or a salesman at a bow shop.

For lighter weight bows, the Grizzlystik Sitka is a fantastic choice that people should look into.

http://www.alaskabowhunting.com/Griz...y-101-W11.aspx

http://www.alaskabowhunting.com/Griz...es-P257C7.aspx

For many of my lower 40's recurves, I use a 29" Sitka. These arrows come with a weighted insert, about 75grs, and I use 150gr Magnus Stingers. That's 225 grs up front with a total weight of around 550grs. I get complete passthru's with this setup, shooting low weight bows.

I also have other light weight recurves where a full length Sitka, with 75gr insert and 85-100gr head works well.

If a woman is shooting a 35lb compound, I'd suggest using a HEAVIER arrow for hunting, not a lighter one. Most compound shooters are already shooting too light of arrows for most typical and practical deer hunting situations.

Think of a 35 compound more like you'd think of a 45lb recurve. Add some arrow weight and get proper spine tuning and you'll quiet the bow down due to a heavier arrow, proper spine will reduce any unneeded "contact" and you'll get better penetration on a hit.

While 2 blades are good choices, they can sometimes lead to a less than exciting blood trail, even on double lung hits. Personally, I'd suggest either the Magnus Stinger or Steelforce Phathead for women, youth or light weight traditional bows. Both have tried and true "bleeder blades", both are pretty much "low profile" that don't hinder penetration, both are hunting sharp out of the pack and both come in a wide selection of weights, all the way from 85gr-150gr for the Stingers and 75gr-200grs with the Phatheads, if you call Steelforce. Most place don't carry most sizes.

But don't get caught up in the conventional wisdom that women or kids somehow need a lighter or "smaller" arrow and head. It may be just the opposite. A bit heavier, bit slower arrow typically out penetrates a faster, lighter arrow. And for most normal whitetail hunting purposes where most women/kids will likely be taking a 10-25 yard shot with a 35-40lb bow, a HEAVIER arrow will benefit them more and make for a faster kill and better blood trails due to penetration, not a lighter arrow.
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 03-20-2012, 04:16 PM
doctorbrady's Avatar
doctorbrady doctorbrady is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: SW Missouri
Posts: 1,279
Default

Lighter heads are not the answer, nor are lighter arrow weights in my opinion. In fact Dr Ashby's studies show just the opposite. The higher the arrow weight, the better the penetration....period! There is a point at which the arrow becomes too heavy to accurately shoot at reasonable distances, but aside from that heavier is better. My wife used 650 grain arrows from her 40# bow in Africa. That would freak most male compound shooters out.
Here's the brief scoop on single bevels. The don't have 1/2 the cutting surface of double bevel heads. The length of the cutting surface is what determines cutting surface, not the type of bevel. In broadhead studies done on 1000's of large game animals (mostly African species and Asiatic water buffalo) single bevels have proven to penetrate better than any other type of broadhead. It has to do with the way in which a single bevel head cuts open an "S" shaped hole with the rotation of the arrow and allows the arrow to pass through with less resistance. They also have greatly increased penetration when thick bone, like shoulder blades, are contacted. This is most important to me as shots are not always "perfect." My 65# recurve is way more than enough for whitetails with just about any head as long as tough bone isn't encountered, but when it is, a single bevel head makes the difference in a recovery and coyote bait.
I agree with Tap, Eclipse single bevels are tough to beat and come really sharp. Also they come in a variety of reasonable weights. Abowyers remain my favs for now due to sheer strength of the tip, but either would be at the very top of my list for heads for lower boundage bows (or any for that matter). These are the only type of heads that I put on game arrows for my wife or younger kids. It's just too important to screw up!
__________________
“Examine each question in terms of what is ethically and aesthetically right, as well as what is economically expedient.”
Aldo Leopold
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 03-20-2012, 08:56 PM
Tree Spud's Avatar
Tree Spud Tree Spud is offline
QDMA Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: South Central Wisconsin - Zone 4b
Posts: 1,827
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JimLeadfoot View Post
My wife has been out of bowhunting for a couple years, any new developments for broadheads? Sometimes it can be hard to find a decent supply of things below 100g.

I have bought a few different things in the past for her, kind of settled on some Montecs.

Any other thoughts, no expandable(s).

A well tuned bow & practice is more important than broadhead selection. A well placed shot always has better efficiency than the choice of broadhead.

And I mean "practice" from all angles, elevations, and what shots to pass on. Put several decoys out in the yard and have her get comfortable with the angles.

For what it is worth, I switched to Montec G5's about 8 years ago. Tried all the others before them. When my aim and choice of shot is correct, dead deer. Montec G5 fixed broadhead in 100 gram would be good ...
__________________
Work for a cause, not for applause. Live life to express, not to impress. Don't strive to make your presence noticed, just make your absence felt
Reply With Quote
  #26  
Old 03-24-2012, 10:50 AM
Tap's Avatar
Tap Tap is offline
QDMA Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Westmoreland Co Pa (zone 6a)
Posts: 3,277
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by doctorbrady View Post
I agree with Tap, Eclipse single bevels are tough to beat and come really sharp. Also they come in a variety of reasonable weights.

Actually, the model of Eclipse that I shoot does NOT come pre-sharpened. They are not too hard to sharpen though. I do mine with a file.
Reply With Quote
  #27  
Old 03-24-2012, 11:03 AM
Tap's Avatar
Tap Tap is offline
QDMA Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Westmoreland Co Pa (zone 6a)
Posts: 3,277
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mojostick View Post

For lighter weight bows, the Grizzlystik Sitka is a fantastic choice that people should look into.

http://www.alaskabowhunting.com/Griz...y-101-W11.aspx

http://www.alaskabowhunting.com/Griz...es-P257C7.aspx

I love my Grizzlystiks. It should be mentioned that they also come in heavier weights for hunting just about anything on the planet.
IMO the best thing about these shafts is that they are tapered which moves the "front of center" balance forward. Grizstiks recover (get straight) very quickly when coming out of the bow... one of the main keys to penetration. You can have the best bow, arrow, and broadhead but if all of the energy is not perfectly straight behind the broadhead, then maximum penetration can't occur.
Reply With Quote
  #28  
Old 03-24-2012, 06:33 PM
bbarrett's Avatar
bbarrett bbarrett is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Live in Louisiana, farms in Missouri and illinois
Posts: 555
Default

my biggest concern with broadhead select for my wife who shoots a bowtech destroyer at 42 lbs is my ability to track the deer she shoots.. so Blood trail..
which is why I had been happy with the rage broadheads... I have always felt that a single entrance wound from a rage would be a better blood trail than a pass thru with other types of heads I have personally used in the past.
I personally chose for her a lighter weight setup so her gaps between pins would be smaller to avoid/reduce judgement errors at distances past 20 yards.
I am now wondering if maybe I didnt approach the problem correctly....
and I am thinking a heavier slower arrow... with more pins on the site??
have her sight in specifically 20,25,30,35... yard pins.. instead of the 20,30,40....

then maybe using the 40 KE rage, vs the eclipse, vs Samurai 125

1 3/16" x 2" from alaska bowhunting..

help!!
Reply With Quote
  #29  
Old 03-24-2012, 09:05 PM
Alpha Doe's Avatar
Alpha Doe Alpha Doe is offline
QDMA Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Pike County, Illinois (USDA Zone 5b)
Posts: 5,169
Default

I tried the Rage 40KE and didn't like them at all...my least fav of broadheads I've tried.

I have my sight set at 20,25,30,35 and 40. There is a mess of pins but like anything else...you get used to it. Shooting the lighter poundage we get alot of drop and it is easier to place the correct pin than trying to decide how high or low to aim to make up for the drop.

I would also think that where you shoot from would make a difference as to how quickly you can find good blood without a pass through. We tend to have our stands pretty high, without an exit wound blood trails take awhile to pick up. I like a nice low exit. They seem to bleed quicker and more steady than one high entrance wound.
__________________

In a world where you can be anything...be yourself!

You can agree with me...or you can be wrong

Swallowing words before you say them is much better than having to eat them afterwards.

http://www.outreachoutdoors.com/

http://www.godvine.com/Carrie-Underw...t-New-392.html

Last edited by Alpha Doe : 03-24-2012 at 09:12 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #30  
Old 03-25-2012, 10:15 AM
Tap's Avatar
Tap Tap is offline
QDMA Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Westmoreland Co Pa (zone 6a)
Posts: 3,277
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bbarrett View Post
my biggest concern with broadhead select for my wife who shoots a bowtech destroyer at 42 lbs is my ability to track the deer she shoots.. so Blood trail..
which is why I had been happy with the rage broadheads... I have always felt that a single entrance wound from a rage would be a better blood trail than a pass thru with other types of heads I have personally used in the past.
I personally chose for her a lighter weight setup so her gaps between pins would be smaller to avoid/reduce judgement errors at distances past 20 yards.
I am now wondering if maybe I didnt approach the problem correctly....
and I am thinking a heavier slower arrow... with more pins on the site??
have her sight in specifically 20,25,30,35... yard pins.. instead of the 20,30,40....

then maybe using the 40 KE rage, vs the eclipse, vs Samurai 125

1 3/16" x 2" from alaska bowhunting..

help!!

Shooting Those longer distances with light weight arrows/heads from lightweight bows is very risky. IMO, the longer the distance to the target, the heavier your projectile needs to be. Light arrows don't maintain kinetic energy well.
The down side to shooting heavier arrows at long ranges is the amount of drop. Bowhunting means sacrifice. You can't have it all. That's what makes it so challenging and success so rewarding. I'd advise keeping shots to under 25 yards.

Your experiences with better blood trails with only an entrance wound (no exit hole) is opposite of what most bowhunters have found. The most highly experienced bowhunters (and writers) that I know, say an exit is THE most important thing in allowing external bleeding (ie blood trail).

Hey brother, it's bowhunting... it's all about getting close, it's not about figuring out ways to shoot farther.
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Powered by vBulletin Version 3.6.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.